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Meat One in Twelve

What does the right and left have in common? They both hate the ways of the Creator. The only difference is the right re-paints the Creator according to their own image, and thus hide the truth. But they both hate the Father in Heaven.

The actual "right" is not the Nazi caricature the leftist media told you about.

Actual right-wingers prefer dangerous freedom to the transitory safety of authoritarian communism.

And freedom is the end result of abiding faith. Which is something that has never been a secret...even to a French atheist:

"Not until I went into the churches of America and heard her pulpits flame with righteousness did I understand the secret of her genius and power. America is great because America is good, and if America ever ceases to be good, America will cease to be great.."

- Alexis de Tocqueville

 
I'm curious if anyone watched the actual trial itself? All of it? Not just pieces. I've been listening/watching while I was doing other things and I'm still not even halfway through it.
 
I'm curious if anyone watched the actual trial itself? All of it? Not just pieces. I've been listening/watching while I was doing other things and I'm still not even halfway through it.
No, I haven’t.
Please let me know if you see something that could add to my understanding.
 
I'm curious if anyone watched the actual trial itself? All of it? Not just pieces. I've been listening/watching while I was doing other things and I'm still not even halfway through it.

I did not watch the entire trial. Just watching parts of it made me feel fury and wrath.
 
No, I haven’t.
Please let me know if you see something that could add to my understanding.
I'm not really sure, but there were some things that I found interesting and that shocked me actually.

For starters, the prosecution led off trying to build a motive by making Lindsay out to be this controlling, lazy, difficult person, who was doctor hopping just to get medication that she was addicted to. They even claimed the motive behind her killing the children was due to her being controlling.

Later on, the prosecution completely contradicted themselves though, they presented evidence that attempted to show that Lindsay was not taking her medication properly. They claimed that out of a 30-day supply of medication, there were only 5 or 7 pills missing. So was she a doctor hopping pill addict or someone who didn't take their medication properly?

The defense and Patrick (her husband), basically disproved that as well, by showing that she was meticulous about taking her medications. The bottles of missing pills that the prosecution presented were actually just old pill bottles, when the doctors would change Lindsay's dosage, they would write her an entirely new prescriptions, she would stop taking the lower dosage medications. Those were the bottles that the prosecution presented, it wasn't as though she was taking anything incorrectly as they alleged.

The defense also proved that Lindsay wasn't doctor hopping for meds, one of her doctors quit, therefore she needed to find a new one, and the other doctors were as a result of her attempting to get help. Like she tried to go to postpartum depression day classes, but the nurses/workers there felt like she needed more help than they could give her, they attempted to contact her doctor but her doctor was on vacation. Lindsay expressed that she wanted to reduce the medications she was on to these particular nurses as well. Which, again, completely disproves what the prosecution put out there at the beginning. She even voluntarily checked herself into week-long mental wards, where she only saw a doctor one time because our healthcare system sucks.

Patrick's testimony completely went against the prosecution, he said she wasn't lazy, that she wasn't controlling, he said she liked to write lists and organize things, but that he appreciated that because they had three kids and they were very busy. He even said she was a good mother and wife "who just got sick."

Which I really wasn't expecting, considering that apparently he's the one who found Lindsay on the ground after she attempted to commit suicide, once a police officer arrived, he went to the basement to check on the children, that's when he found them with the workout bands around their necks. He removed those, checked for a pulse, I think one of two of the children had faint pulses, one child was rushed one to the ER, and he sadly died 4 days later.

Apparently a month prior to all of this happening, Lindsay sat down at the table with Patrick and his mother (who is a registered nurse), she told them that she had thoughts of harming the children. They did the typical "do you have a plan?" responses, she told them no. Not long before that, she told her husband that she felt like there was something deeply wrong with the kids, even if they just had a minor cold or a minor stomach ache, she felt like there was something way more serious going on.

Some of these things reminded me of the Andrea Yates trial, Andrea Yates thought that even minor sicknesses were a sign of her children being demon possessed. She actually claimed she killed the children because they were getting sicker and wouldn't be allowed into heaven if she let it continue. Andrea Yates was so mentally unwell, she would sit and rock for days at a time in a chair.

Because of the Andrea Yates case, I started looking more into postpartum depression and psychosis, apparently other mental illnesses differ from postpartum, even though they share similar symptoms at times, because the mother's symptoms almost always primarily hyper focus on the children in some manner. Apparently the psychosis can happen incredibly fast as well, the women can go from being "fine," one minute to being in psychosis next.

Also, aside from the one hold out juror, the other jurors were going to find her not guilty based on reason of insanity. Like Andrea Yates, she wouldn't be let go, she'd be confined to a state run facility, likely for the rest of her life.

When you look more into the "Free Lindsay," movements, the women actually believe that Patrick likely did this, claiming there's more evidence against him than against Lindsay. If you watch the trial you'll see that the police didn't really treat this like a crime scene (which is understandable, they were all traumatized and shocked themselves), but still they hurt the case by not securing the scene quickly enough and by not investigating and ruling out other alternatives.

Basically there was Patrick who found Lindsay, he contaminates the crime scene, takes the workout bands off the children's necks (as anyone would do), but he remains there with the EMS and police, all of whom are also contaminating the scene as well. The only person you have saying that Lindsay even did this herself, was Patrick.

I kind of believe that a lot of this speculation could have been avoided if the police and detectives had done a more thorough job from the beginning. A case involving children murdered should have been treated with far more care in my opinion.

The prosecutors approach reminded me of the prosecutors in the Casey Anthony trial, and even though they were right about Casey Anthony's character, the jurors really didn't like that approach. On top of that, in this case you have the prosecution contradicting themselves in their own opening statements, just to be disproven by the defense and the husband. They really weren't doing themselves any favors.

And, I didn't realize until the trial that Patrick and Lindsay both have lawsuits against Lindsay's latest doctor, this is the doctor that continuously wanted to do Telehealth (virtual) visits with someone suffering from postpartum. I believe she's also the one who prescribed Zoloft and Seroquel. I've known people who have taken both, Seroquel in particular is horrible, I was actually shocked to see that it's still even on the market. I know so many people personally who have taken it and had suicidal and homicidal thoughts that they previously did not have.

Giving that sort of medication to someone suffering from postpartum, who is already having those thoughts is a ticking time bomb.
 
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I did not watch the entire trial. Just watching parts of it made me feel fury and wrath.
I couldn't even fully watch some of the testimony involving what each officer and EMS found when it came to the children. It gave me the similar feelings I got during the Lori Vallow/Chad Daybell trial.
 
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I'm curious if anyone watched the actual trial itself? All of it? Not just pieces. I've been listening/watching while I was doing other things and I'm still not even halfway through it.
As a general rule, I tend not to indulge in trials. I followed some of the Trump law fare stuff. Those were hilarious.

I don’t know enough about this particular trial to comment too much. I didn’t realize there were “the father did it” conspiracies out there.

Murders do tend to have gender specific characteristics. Exercise bands doesn’t seem like a male MO to me. Again, I don’t know too much about the whole situation.
 
I'm not really sure, but there were some things that I found interesting and that shocked me actually.

For starters, the prosecution led off trying to build a motive by making Lindsay out to be this controlling, lazy, difficult person, who was doctor hopping just to get medication that she was addicted to. They even claimed the motive behind her killing the children was due to her being controlling.

Later on, the prosecution completely contradicted themselves though, they presented evidence that attempted to show that Lindsay was not taking her medication properly. They claimed that out of a 30-day supply of medication, there were only 5 or 7 pills missing. So was she a doctor hopping pill addict or someone who didn't take their medication properly?

The defense and Patrick (her husband), basically disproved that as well, by showing that she was meticulous about taking her medications. The bottles of missing pills that the prosecution presented were actually just old pill bottles, when the doctors would change Lindsay's dosage, they would write her an entirely new prescriptions, she would stop taking the lower dosage medications. Those were the bottles that the prosecution presented, it wasn't as though she was taking anything incorrectly as they alleged.

The defense also proved that Lindsay wasn't doctor hopping for meds, one of her doctors quit, therefore she needed to find a new one, and the other doctors were as a result of her attempting to get help. Like she tried to go to postpartum depression day classes, but the nurses/workers there felt like she needed more help than they could give her, they attempted to contact her doctor but her doctor was on vacation. Lindsay expressed that she wanted to reduce the medications she was on to these particular nurses as well. Which, again, completely disproves what the prosecution put out there at the beginning. She even voluntarily checked herself into week-long mental wards, where she only saw a doctor one time because our healthcare system sucks.

Patrick's testimony completely went against the prosecution, he said she wasn't lazy, that she wasn't controlling, he said she liked to write lists and organize things, but that he appreciated that because they had three kids and they were very busy. He even said she was a good mother and wife "who just got sick."

Which I really wasn't expecting, considering that apparently he's the one who found Lindsay on the ground after she attempted to commit suicide, once a police officer arrived, he went to the basement to check on the children, that's when he found them with the workout bands around their necks. He removed those, checked for a pulse, I think one of two of the children had faint pulses, one child was rushed one to the ER, and he sadly died 4 days later.

Apparently a month prior to all of this happening, Lindsay sat down at the table with Patrick and his mother (who is a registered nurse), she told them that she had thoughts of harming the children. They did the typical "do you have a plan?" responses, she told them no. Not long before that, she told her husband that she felt like there was something deeply wrong with the kids, even if they just had a minor cold or a minor stomach ache, she felt like there was something way more serious going on.

Some of these things reminded me of the Andrea Yates trial, Andrea Yates thought that even minor sicknesses were a sign of her children being demon possessed. She actually claimed she killed the children because they were getting sicker and wouldn't be allowed into heaven if she let it continue. Andrea Yates was so mentally unwell, she would sit and rock for days at a time in a chair.

Because of the Andrea Yates case, I started looking more into postpartum depression and psychosis, apparently other mental illnesses differ from postpartum, even though they share similar symptoms at times, because the mother's symptoms almost always primarily hyper focus on the children in some manner. Apparently the psychosis can happen incredibly fast as well, the women can go from being "fine," one minute to being in psychosis next.

Also, aside from the one hold out juror, the other jurors were going to find her not guilty based on reason of insanity. Like Andrea Yates, she wouldn't be let go, she'd be confined to a state run facility, likely for the rest of her life.

When you look more into the "Free Lindsay," movements, the women actually believe that Patrick likely did this, claiming there's more evidence against him than against Lindsay. If you watch the trial you'll see that the police didn't really treat this like a crime scene (which is understandable, they were all traumatized and shocked themselves), but still they hurt the case by not securing the scene quickly enough and by not investigating and ruling out other alternatives.

Basically there was Patrick who found Lindsay, he contaminates the crime scene, takes the workout bands off the children's necks (as anyone would do), but he remains there with the EMS and police, all of whom are also contaminating the scene as well. The only person you have saying that Lindsay even did this herself, was Patrick.

I kind of believe that a lot of this speculation could have been avoided if the police and detectives had done a more thorough job from the beginning. A case involving children murdered should have been treated with far more care in my opinion.

The prosecutors approach reminded me of the prosecutors in the Casey Anthony trial, and even though they were right about Casey Anthony's character, the jurors really didn't like that approach. On top of that, in this case you have the prosecution contradicting themselves in their own opening statements, just to be disproven by the defense and the husband. They really weren't doing themselves any favors.

And, I didn't realize until the trial that Patrick and Lindsay both have lawsuits against Lindsay's latest doctor, this is the doctor that continuously wanted to do Telehealth (virtual) visits with someone suffering from postpartum. I believe she's also the one who prescribed Zoloft and Seroquel. I've known people who have taken both, Seroquel in particular is horrible, I was actually shocked to see that it's still even on the market. I know so many people personally who have taken it and had suicidal and homicidal thoughts that they previously did not have.

Giving that sort of medication to someone suffering from postpartum, who is already having those thoughts is a ticking time bomb.
Thank you for taking the time to write this.
It’s definitely a complicated situation.

Quite frankly, if I woke up and found that I had done something like this I think that I would quietly accept the consequences.
I wouldn’t want to live with the understanding of what I had done.
 
Thank you for taking the time to write this.
It’s definitely a complicated situation.

Quite frankly, if I woke up and found that I had done something like this I think that I would quietly accept the consequences.
I wouldn’t want to live with the understanding of what I had done.
I can’t say for sure but I feel like if I murdered or sexually abused one of my own kids, I’d rather just die than live with the guilt, regardless of the circumstances. None of us know unless we walk in those shoes but life would essentially be over anyway. How do you find peace after that?
 
Actually that's what Andrea Yates said, once she became mentally competent, and realized what she'd done, she refused to seek parole of any kind.
I’m giving this both 💕 and 😥
 
A case involving children murdered should have been treated with far more care in my opinion.

Hold up here a second. This wasn't just a crime scene it was also the scene of numerous people trying to save the lives of the children.

Don't conflate the people trying to save the kids with a bunch of incompetents contaminating a crime scene. That's not what happened here.

The first responders (police, fire, and medics) were justly fulfilling their first obligation of trying to save lives. Sorry that ruined the crime scene investigation but what would you have them do? Let the kids die so they can make a good criminal case?

Of course not.
 
Hold up here a second. This wasn't just a crime scene it was also the scene of numerous people trying to save the lives of the children.

Don't conflate the people trying to save the kids with a bunch of incompetents contaminating a crime scene. That's not what happened here.

The first responders (police, fire, and medics) were justly fulfilling their first obligation of trying to save lives. Sorry that ruined the crime scene investigation but what would you have them do? Let the kids die so they can make a good criminal case?

Of course not.
No, and it's odd that you'd even suggest those things.
If you watch the trial you'll see that the police didn't really treat this like a crime scene (which is understandable, they were all traumatized and shocked themselves)
Basically there was Patrick who found Lindsay, he contaminates the crime scene, takes the workout bands off the children's necks (as anyone would do),
Two things can be true at once, I believe they all were obviously trying to save the children's lives, however they still contaminated the crime scene at the same time, and allowed someone who could have been a suspect himself do so as well.

Similar things happened in the JonBenet Ramsey and Casey Anthony case, and we see how those ended up. Child killers getting away. It could have easily happened here as well, even if it is highly likely that Lindsay Clancy is the one who did it, they still have to prove it.

And most importantly someone there should have protected that scene for the sake of the children. Imagine if their killer was the one performing "live saving" efforts on them.
 
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No, and it's odd that you'd even suggest those things.


Two things can be true at once, I believe they all were obviously trying to save the children's lives, however they still contaminated the crime scene at the same time, and allowed someone who could have been a suspect himself do so as well.

Similar things happened in the JonBenet Ramsey and Casey Anthony case, and we see how those ended up. Child killers getting away. It could have easily happened here as well, even if it is highly likely that Lindsay Clancy is the one who did it, they still have to prove it.

And most importantly someone there should have protected that scene for the sake of the children. Imagine if their killer was the one performing "live saving" efforts on them.
One thing making is highly unlikely that the dad killed the kids is the extremely low rate that fathers do. Most children killed by a natural parent are killed by their mother.
 
As I understand it, her killing of the children is not what is being disputed by the prosecution or the defense. It's the mental culpability that is being questioned.
The prosecution certainly wouldn't dispute it, the defense disputed it during the retrial phase arguments. Her attorney argued that the prosecution didn't present any forensic evidence that Lindsay committed the murders. He also argued that she was only told of the events and has no recollection of them herself. During the trial, Patrick says he discovers Lindsay outside on the ground, he asks her where the children are, she says in the basement. When an officer arrives, Patrick goes to the basement to check on the kids, that's when he finds them. When EMS and Officers came into the basement, Patrick screams "she killed the f*cking kids." The other person to claim that Lindsay admitted guilt was the hospital Chaplain.
 
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One thing making is highly unlikely that the dad killed the kids is the extremely low rate that fathers do. Most children killed by a natural parent are killed by their mother.
I thought it was higher for fathers? I could be wrong though. I actually think it's highly likely that she did this, but the majority of evidence so far seems to rest on Patrick and the hospital Chaplain's words. It seems as though a lot of the physical evidence could be easily argued away.
 
I thought it was higher for fathers? I could be wrong though. I actually think it's highly likely that she did this, but the majority of evidence so far seems to rest on Patrick and the hospital Chaplain's words. It seems as though a lot of the physical evidence could be easily argued away.
AI says I was wrong.
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By the way, I was mostly just explaining what seems to be the consensus among the "Free Lindsay" people. I'm basing my personal opinions on what I've seen in the trial so far. I'm not entirely sure what to think/feel yet, other than sadness for those babies.
 
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